Lost Black History Almost Erased Forever | Jason Green Interview

Interview With Jason Green

[00:00:00]

Lost Black History, The Church & Stories Too Precious To Lose 🖤⛪📚

Bruce Anthony: What happens when an entire Black community disappears from history so completely that the only thing left is a memory of the elders who lived it? We gonna get into it. Let's get it.

Bruce Anthony: Welcome. First of all, welcome. This is Unsolicited Perspectives. I am your host, Bruce Anthony, here to lead the conversation in important events and topics that are shaping today's society. Join the conversation and follow us wherever you get your audio podcasts. Subscribe to our YouTube channel for our video podcast, YouTube exclusive content, and our YouTube membership.

Rate, review, like, comment, share. Share with your family, share with your friends. Hell, even share with your enemies. On today's episode,

Jason Green Explores Black History Nearly Lost Forever 😔📖🖤

Bruce Anthony: I'm talking with Jason G. Green, former Obama White House official and author of "Too Precious to Lose." This story is about forgotten Black communities, hidden history, the role of the Black church, and [00:01:00] why preserving these stories matter now more than ever. But that's enough of the intro.

Let's get to the show.

​

Bruce Anthony: One thing people learn about me pretty quickly is that I love history I mean, I really love history. Not the watered-down version they give us at school where every problem magically gets solved after one speech or one march. I'm talking about real history, the unforgettable history, the hidden history, the history that explains why the world works the way it does right now.

Because history is a cheat code for the future. If you really study history, patterns start to jump out at you. You start realizing people keep making the same mistakes, systems keep repeating themselves, and power keeps finding new ways to protect itself. History teaches you how people survived, how communities were built, how they were destroyed, and more importantly, how [00:02:00]

Quince Orchard History Was Nearly Erased From Memory 😳📚🕰️

Bruce Anthony: they fought to preserve themselves anyway.

That's why this upcoming conversation with Jason Green is so important to me, because this isn't just a conversation about genealogy or family memories. This is about what happens when one man sits besides his grandmother and realizes she's carrying an entire world inside of her memory, the history almost lost forever.

Jason went from serving in the Obama White House to walking away from one of the most prestigious jobs in the country after learning his grandmother was nearing the end of her life. And while sitting beside her listening to her stories, he uncovered the history of Quince Orchard, a thriving Black community that had almost vanished from public memory. And what makes this conversation even more important is that so much African American history is still being erased right now. Books are being challenged. Hist- historical context is being stripped away.

Entire stories are being reduced down to footnotes or removed altogether. But the truth is, this country has always struggled with preserving Black history, honestly. That [00:03:00] didn't start today. So in this episode, we're gonna talk about history, family, identity, and preserving history. We're gonna talk about the Black church and why it was always more than just religion. We're gonna talk about leadership, belonging, and the emotional weight of uncovering sacrifices your ancestors made so that you could stand where you are today.

Because if we lose the stories, eventually we lose the lessons too, and that's dangerous. So today's episode is about history, it's about family, it's about preserving history, and it's about why some stories are simply too precious to lose. Without further ado, Jason Green

All right. As I said at the top, I'm here with Jason Green. Look, first off, let me just say up top, he's talking about a subject that's personal to me as well as him because we went to high school together. We went to Quince

Bruce & Jason Reconnect Thirty Years After High School 🏡🎙️👀

Bruce Anthony: Orchard [00:04:00] High School, and we're talking about the Quince Orchard community, and this is the first time in 30 years that, that we've actually had an in-depth conversation, probably less than that, but you know what I mean.

Jason, it's a pleasure to have you on the show because this is something that I think is so very, very important and that is history that is lost to time. More importantly, Black American history that is lost to time. So Jason, thank you so much for coming on the show and enlightening me and this audience about this very, very important topic that we're about to talk about.

Jason Green: Bruce, it is so good to see you, man, and thank you for having me on the show. You didn't need to say the number of how many years it's been, but, uh, but it's, it's a pleasure to be with you, brother

Bruce Anthony: Hey brother, sometimes we gotta let people know, right, that we're up here... Well, you are. I, I, look hard living has, has placed its toll on me. You up here looking like the same from 1996, '97 [00:05:00] when Michael Jordan was in, still playing in his prime. So let the people know that, that you aging well and that you're out here doing good, good things in this world.

Jason Green: Let him know.

Bruce Anthony: a beautiful thing to have.

Jason Green: will take it. We can end, end the interview right there. That's, that's a

Bruce Anthony: Nah.

Jason Green: you. That's a win. I'll walk off. End the head

Bruce Anthony: All right, Jason, I start every interview with something simple but also complicated. Let's go back to the beginning. I wanna know about your childhood. I wanna know about your upbringing. I wanna know about growing up in the Black church and all the environment that has shaped you to become the person that you are today

Jason Green: Yeah. Well, as you already said, Bruce, I grew up in Quince Orchard. I'm a, I'm the product of a Methodist preacher and a public school teacher. My mom worked at Ridgeview and the middle school in the Quince Orchard community. And my dad was a Methodist preacher at a couple different churches i-in the area growing up.

But I grew up kind of in this, like, last Black [00:06:00] alcove in a rapidly sort of gentrifying diversifying community, right? So the rest of Quince Orchard was, was a little bit more diverse, more white. The street I grew up on, you know, I grew up on a dirt road, uh, that my grandparents lived at the top of, that my parents lived at the bottom of, aunts and uncles, cousins lived in between.

And so when you talk about growing up and what the influence of the Black church, for me, that looks like accountability, right? Like, I grew up with a lot of aunts and uncles and people that we called aunt, uncle, cousins that weren't necessarily blood-related, but they had this just, like, vested interest in me and us and all the kids, and making sure that we did what we were supposed to do, right?

I don't know who we were being measured to, but it was always, "You, this is what you're supposed to be doing." And so there was that standard bearer. And so I, you know, I would say that Quince Orchard, growing up the way I grew up, was one of those places where if I did something wrong, I'd get in trouble four times before I got home because there were enough [00:07:00] people holding me accountable, and that's certainly true in the Black church.

When you think about, you know, me being on the usher board, when I think about, you know, who was, what we were supposed to do in

Growing Up As A Preacher's Kid Came With Pressure 😮‍💨⛪🧠

Jason Green: Sunday school, what we were supposed to do after Sunday school, there was just a lot of accountability on doing the, quote-unquote, "right thing" and doing what will make my daddy proud and, and people who were...

loved us enough to hold us accountable, say those things, and keep us on that straight and narrow

Bruce Anthony: Detour time. What type of pressure does that put on young people? What I mean by that is you're the son of a preacher, right? So there is an immense pressure to do the right thing to succeed. How does that weigh on you as you're growing up? Do you even acknowledge that pressure? Do you feel that pressure?

Does it, does it make you stay in that lane? Because we often hear about preachers' kids being the bad kids, and I know [00:08:00] from personal experience from knowing you, you were not that. So, uh, like you, you talk about this Black community, this Black cult- uh, uh, church culture. How did that pressure not break you?

Jason Green: I, I mean, you're right. It is a, it's a pressure cooker space, right? When you have that expectations constantly being in set and, and accountability constantly being held to. You know, I, I think that interestingly for me, my dad actually served as the release for a lot of that pressure. Growing up I don't talk much about this in, in this book, and I don't think we even had much conversation about it, but, like, I, I had a real period of depression, brought on by this expectation of perfection, that, that I created.

Like, no one expects anyone else to be perfect, right? That's, that's largely internal, but that's how I manifested a lot of the accountability. It was this ex- perfection. And so though I had good relationships, though I did pretty well in school, like I was [00:09:00] consumed by the relationships I didn't have, the cons- the grades I didn't achieve, right?

And, and so I remember my dad, uh, sitting me down, and this was like over time, right? So, there are folks who have been diagnosed clinically depressed, and I don't wanna give any short shrift to that. That's very serious. But I remember like being able to-- You know, that's the luxury of having a preacher father who's also a counselor and, and just like deeply present, and him saying to me, you know, "Perfection is unobtainable."

Right? And so in some respects, taking that load off my back. But one of the things that was important for me and is still a driving factor is like he didn't let me completely off the hook. So he said, "Perfection is unobtainable, but it's the quest for it that makes life worth living." And so he said, "Look, bro, you are not gonna be perfect.

You were made... God made you perfectly imperfect, but we have a responsibility and opportunity and obligation to try and make this world a little bit more perfect for other people." And so in, in saying that

His Father's Advice Completely Changed His Future 💡🙏🔥

Jason Green: I [00:10:00] didn't need to be perfect, he also gave me a purpose

Bruce Anthony: All right.

Jason Green: And so most of my work from then has been around trying to build spaces one way or another, whether it's like in a running for student government in high school or, or, or in college or trying to even with this book. It's like, how do we build spaces where people can feel like they belong, where they feel respected and dignified and seen?

Like that's, that's the type of a greater perfect that, that we can build together.

Bruce Anthony: And around what age did your father have this conversation? At what age were you feeling this type of immense pressure that was leading to a depressive state?

Jason Green: This was like end of middle school, early high school

Bruce Anthony: Mm-hmm. Wow, that's, that's young to be feeling that, but also so very, very important that your father recognized that and had that

conversation with you.

Jason Green: I feel so-- [00:11:00] I'm grateful. Like, it's still a, a quote that will draw tears from both of us to this day. It's still a quote that, you know, for, for a while when I was in the White House, it hung on my clipboard. Like, it's still something that is a motivator and a reinforcer, and I'm deeply grateful that, you know, as the, as the clouds were forming, that, that, uh, that he was willing to stick with me there

Bruce Anthony: Yeah. So leading into that, you, you, you have this new purpose and you run for student government in high school and college, and you, your trajectory of success propels you all the way to the White House where you're working with the Obama administration. How did growing up In that Black cul- uh, uh, church culture and in that neighborhood where everybody is saying you're the next one, that conversation with your father to, to say that you're [00:12:00] perfectly imperfect, how did that propel you all the way to the White

Family Expectations Pushed Him Toward His Purpose 👨‍👩‍👦📈✨

Bruce Anthony: House?

How did those values that you learned at that young age get you to that

Jason Green: It's interesting. So I had the opportunity to sit with my grandmother, right, interview her, and one of... During one of those interviews, Bruce, someone asked her, "Did you ever expect to have a, see a Black president?" Right? And she said, "Oh, never in life did I think that we were gonna have a Black president."

And then the interviewer goes, "If you were gonna have a Black president, would you ever expect that your kin would be in the administration working for them?" And the, the interviewer was expecting her to be like, "Oh, no, this is amazing." And my grandmother was like, "Well, yeah. If you're gonna have a Black president, then I expect that we were gonna be there."

You know, and it's just kind of that, it's still that accountability train that was that I experienced growing up. There's why not you? Why not participate in this? Uh, continue to strive. Let's continue to make [00:13:00] history. Those are the opportunities that I didn't fully appreciate that my grandmother had had been doing her entire life.

I didn't appreciate that she had been this kind of radical his-history maker. But some of that was just apparent. You know, I learned through watching her, uh, the, the capacity of service. I learned through watching her the ability to do multiple things at once, right? My grandmother had, like, three or four jobs her entire life, and so it made it...

W- People sometimes say, "Well, how did you do law school and, you know, do the Obama campaign?" I'm like, "My grandma had four jo- What are you talking about?" Like, this is, these are exam- My grandfather had three different jobs. These are the examples that I just saw growing up, that you figure it out, right? If this is, this is the North Star, and this needs to happen at the same time, then you figure out a way to make it happen, and that is kind of the, the arc of the Black experience.

You just figure it out. It's resilience, it's persistence, it's continued existence. [00:14:00] It's, it's figuring it out. And so I think those lessons, in many respects, drove me. You know, I had a lot of peers who said, "Oh, I'd like to do that, too," finish school, work for the campaign, but didn't do it. And I feel like I just had enough examples showing me that you could do it, uh, to, to, to take the chance, take the risk

Bruce Anthony: Mm-hmm. Once again, we're gonna go back to you are the son of a preacher. How did you go from being in the church

Jason Green: Mm-hmm.

Bruce Anthony: to going to the White

Public Service Became His Own Version Of Ministry 🏛️❤️🙌

Bruce Anthony: House and not necessarily going into ministry? But even more than that, do politics and public service While you were working on the campaign and working in the White House, did it feel like a form of ministry for you?

Jason Green: Oh, without a doubt. I mean, I think it's worth it going back again to, to the streets where we started. So we talk about this community of Crenshaw. [00:15:00] Sure. My parents both worked, right? My dad's public-- He was a teacher and a preacher. My mom is a, a, a, a teacher, and so I got dropped off at grandma's. So I had to ride with her.

She volunteered at the local hospital, right, Tuesdays and Thursdays. So in elementary school, in, in kindergarten, I got dropped off there. And so at f- imagine five years old, I'm going to the local hospital with grandma, seeing her sit with people late in life, right? Walk into these rooms that I didn't always wanna be in, but she was there with kinda the answer, right?

She was the oracle. She knew what to do. Uh, she'd hold a hand, she'd make a joke, she'd give an o- ice chip or read The Upper Room, whatever it was. And so I got to see people's lives be better and respected and dignified because she was there. And I was like, "Okay, that's, that's my introduction to service," right?

And so you extrapolate this. Th-my grandmother thought that [00:16:00] we were there because we... it is our responsibility to love. That is also sort of pulled from a faith tradition, right? You, you could make an argument that the church is supposed to be a, a place that is sort of an advocacy of love, and she would say service is also a manifestation of love.

And so when I think about my role in, you know, turning that into a profession, you know, I, I used to dutifully follow my father. I'd sneak downstairs on Saturday nights and listen to him perform his sermons, right? And I was like, "That's what I wanna do," until he said, "Son, you know, think long and hard about this because your life will never be your own."

Bruce Anthony: Mm.

Jason Green: up on a path arguably parallel, right? There's nothing, no higher service than, than, than faith and, and probably second to that military, but, but public service, a calling to, to make other people's lives better, were deeply influenced by my dad being in the pulpit and my, my grandmother being a servant leader.[00:17:00]

And so when I think about public service, for me, and, and, and even short of that word politics, like public service is supposed to be

His Grandmother Taught Him Service Through Healing 🏥👵💖

Jason Green: a manifestation of love to a constituency. And so that's what drew me to it, the capacity to try and make people's lives better. And government service at the state, local, and federal level, at its heart, for me, is trying to make people's lives better

Bruce Anthony: Wow. And it all starts really on those trips with your grandmother at a very, very young age. And, and you said you didn't necessarily wanna be in those rooms. I can understand that because who actually Wants to be around death. That's what it was. But in that moment, your grandmother is teaching you at their darkest time, let's bring them some light.

And, and you took that, and you took that, and you took the lessons from your father, your grandmother, [00:18:00] and you propelled. And public service, public service, whether your ministry, military, it's all public service. It's all under the same umbrella. So it's, it's fitting that you would be following in that path. ​

Now, you get a phone call

Jason Green: Yeah

Bruce Anthony: that this woman who showed you the light is now entering in her dark days, and you decide to leave the administration and go by her bedside. I just wanna talk about the emotion that was running through you at that time, getting that phone call, that very, very tough decision to leave the service, the public service that you're doing, th- your path [00:19:00] to go be with the person that showed you the light in other people's darkness and go be the light in her darkness. Tell me about that emotion and that ride of making that decision.

Jason Green: It may not be the emotion that you're thinking about. I, I was feeling and carrying a lot of guilt

Bruce Anthony: Mm, okay.

Leaving The White House To Sit Beside Grandma 😢🏛️👵

Jason Green: I was for not being there.

Bruce Anthony: Mm.

Jason Green: So in some respects, I had been on this selfless act of public service, right?

Bruce Anthony: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Jason Green: Another lens to view that is I had been on this six-year journey of self-importance, right? Where I'd gone off to Yale Law School, I'd joined the Obama campaign, I'd gone to the White House, right?

And so I'm working in the White House, and you know, home is only 30 miles away, and I hadn't been there, right? So, so I get the fateful call that you're talking about. My mother calls me on my desk phone at the White House, and I let the call go to voicemail, right?

Bruce Anthony: Wow.

Jason Green: [00:20:00] And she calls the switchboard at the White House.

They patch her through to me, and I take the call, and she says, "You know, your grandmother, ninety-five years old, in the hospital. You should probably go see her." I mean, that, even that call, like, I knew I should have already been there. So that call was a, a, you know, really a call to action. Then I show up, and all of the memories start flooding back.

Like, my grandma's not just in the hospital, she's in the same hospital that she used to take me to at five years old. Like, walking into those rooms I didn't wanna be in, unsure, and she said, "We're not here to save anybody, we're here to serve somebody." And it was like, "Okay. I-- Okay, God, I get it. You want me to sit with her."

Now, Bruce, I did not know that I was gonna leave the White House at that point, right? I thought I was gonna have a, a Sunday, nice Sunday afternoon conversation with my grandmother and my mom, and then that turned into, "I, I need to do this again." So I came back, and then eventually that turned into, this is where my mind [00:21:00] and my heart are, and it's a dangerous place to work in the White House

The Guilt He Carried While Working Inside DC 😔📞💭

Jason Green: Counsel's Office if your mind and your heart aren't in it.

And so ultimately I said, "I, I need to go and pursue more of that conversation that my grandmother's having." But part of what, you know, led to that guilt, I asked my sister. So my sister, three years older than me, I said, "Did you know all these stories that Grandma was telling me?" And she said, "Yeah. How didn't you?"

Right? So she, on her way to Quince Orchard High School, she had breakfast with Grandma and Grandpa every day on her way to school, and, like, soaked up the stories and heard the tales and had a really strong foundation on who she was and who she was-- whose she was. And, like, I'm getting that fifteen years later because the last thing I wanted to do on my way to Quince Orchard was sit at my grandma-- Like, there was ball to play, girls to chase.

Like, there was enough to do that I, that, that sitting with Grandma was not on the top of my list. And [00:22:00] so I think I was carrying, realizing that I hadn't made the time to understand some of these things. And now at ninety-five on her presumptive deathbed, I'm like, "Hey, Grandma, you know, can you make time now to tell me the story?"

So, so, so that was one of the emotions. When it finally came time to make the decision, right? So leave the White House, go be with my grandmother I questioned it. I questioned it for years and years and years as I watched friends continue to climb, you know, the leadership, the GS scale, be- get appointed at, at, uh, Senate-confirmed positions, go off to be ambassadors and secretaries and, un-until the day my grandmother died.

And, and it was like immediately, it's like, "Oh, of course, this was the right decision. Of course, the opportunity to sit with her and learn her story and mine was the right decision." But honestly, Bruce, until that day, I, I still questioned whether the, it was the right decision

Bruce Anthony: Mm. Mm. How do you... Okay, you're questioning it. How did, how did you come to that [00:23:00] decision? Uh, because you're saying that you need to... You're, you're going back more and more to go see your grandmother and have these conversations, and your mind is wandering, and it's like, "I can't be White House Counsel with my mind

Forgotten Black Communities Built Their Own Future 🏘️✊📖

Bruce Anthony: wandering."

What's that like, that, that moment where you make the decision, "This is what I have to do right here in this moment"? And better yet, when is it that you're hearing these stories that you say, "Hmm, this isn't just our family history. This is American history that has been forgotten"?

Jason Green: Oh, that's a perfect frame. So there's really two stories that kinda get me out of the White House, right? The first is my grandmother telling me about the, the sort of founding story of this Black community of Quince Orchard, which we are both, you and I, are the beneficiaries of. So in 1868, [00:24:00] you know, shortly after emancipation, my great-great-grandfather and other men pooled together $54, so community resources, to buy three acres of land to build the schoolhouse, the church building, the social hall, right, lay the plat for the cemetery, truly the sort of life cycle of the Black community.

So they, they built the foundation of that community. It's called Pleasant View, and I had been there every summer of my childhood but didn't know the story, didn't appreciate the story, that shortly after emancipation, with, with very little resources, they decided to build a community, right? Like, I don't know that that's where exactly where my heart would've been.

So that really shook me that that decision happened, that a community was built and sustained, right? Those buildings still stand 158 years later, and I didn't know it. That was one of the things that shook me. And then if you fast-forward the clock 100 years into the [00:25:00] future, from 1868 to 1968, my grandmother told me how in her generation, that Black church that had been founded had fallen on hard financial times, right?

And so one night, that church pooled everyone together into the sanctuary to figure out what are we

Dr. King's Death Changed These Churches Forever 🕊️🖤⚡

Jason Green: gonna do? Which direction are we gonna take? And jumping, jumping-- You know, there's a lot that went through that, but jumping to the conclusion of that, that was the night that Dr. King was assassinated in Memphis, Tennessee.

So as they're debating these different directions, they get word that he has been killed And yet they still decide to, uh, merge their congregation with two historically white congregations, one of which is Northern, one of which is Southern. And so, and in September of that year, that's April 4th, 1968, that that meeting's taking place, but in then, in September of that year, they have their last segregated service and have been this [00:26:00] intentionally integrated congregation for the last 58 years. It was those two stories together that made me say, "Wait, wait, wait." To your point, like this isn't just me learning about Green family lore. Like there's some really interesting dynamics that are happening here that might have some lessons to extract to apply to the country where we are today. Like, how did those three racially segregated churches figure it out?

How did they, you know, look at their individual histories, s-services, leadership, choirs, and think about how they were gonna bind those things together to forge a new and different future? Like that, that feels very much aligned with the questions that a lot of us are asking ourselves right now. Like how do we keep this social experiment together?

And so that's... Those two stories and then the subsequent conversations made me think that there's something more here than just me putting together the Green family reunion pamphlet.

Bruce Anthony: Okay, [00:27:00] so you, you find out this history that... Let me go. You, you knew that this place existed, but you didn't really know why. Y- then you find out all these churches merge, and you're finding this out from your grandmother in her darkest moment. When do you say to yourself, "I need to do research on this,"

Jason Green: Yeah

Bruce Anthony: how did the logistics of this happen?

We see so much during the civil rights movement of how there was so much pushback from white folks and integration. Entering into schools, entering in neighborhoods. We see damn near riots in other areas that are not far, Pennsylvania, New Jersey, right? Not even going further south, going further north.

How was it that this community survived [00:28:00] this?

Jason Green: So on the archives point, such a good

Quince Orchard Was Once A Thriving Black Community 😳🏡📜

Jason Green: question. You know, I, I grew up walking up and down Quince Orchard Road, went to Quince Orchard High School, so I knew that name, but I never knew it as a place, right? And so one day, walking into my grandmother's hospital room, she said, "I miss my hometown." I'm like, "Grandma, what are you talking about?

We're in Gaithersburg. We're, we're still here, right here." She said, "I didn't, I didn't grow up in Gaithersburg. I wasn't born in Gaithersburg. I was born in Quince Orchard." And I said, "Oh, Grandma, so sad. You know, this is so sad to see such a sharp woman decline so quickly," you know, all that nonsense. And I said, "Grandma, Quince Orchard's not a place.

It's a street. Now it's a high school, but it was just a street." And that was, like, our first tense moment that I couldn't let that slide. So that took me into the archives, right? So I dug into the stacks. I found an article from 1908 where The Washington Post is encouraging [00:29:00] Washingtonians to get out of DC and go check out some of the surrounding towns, and there in black and white it says Quince Orchard, right?

Which somehow seeing it in print made it real, and so I went back out to my grandmother and said, "Did you ever know that Quince Orchard was a place?" You know, like, somehow I needed that validation to go and, and check the source. But that piece of paper also said Quince Orchard noted for its churches, and that, uh, helped me sort of start that conversation to figure out what was going on with this church dynamic.

But to your point also on how did this community actually survive this is really interesting because I've... There is a perception of what Montgomery County is that doesn't exactly align with the history of Black communities, these f- you know, post-emancipation Black communities that existed across Montgomery County.

People are like, "Black, Black people didn't live in Montgomery County." Like, that's just not true. At one point, you know, almost a third of the population of Montgomery County was, was Black people. [00:30:00] And so People will always say, "Well, that church merger can happen in a place like Montgomery County where you don't have a history of slavery, where you don't have a history of state-sponsored segregation, where you don't have a history of racial terror."

And so that's why it was really important for me to sort of capture this fuller story to say that, you know, go into the stacks to share my family's

His Father Helped Integrate Maryland Public Schools 🏫✊🔥

Jason Green: story of enslavement, not in Montgomery, Alabama, but in Montgomery County, Maryland, to talk about, you know, the existence of segregation in Montgomery County, in Quince Orchard, in Gaithersburg.

You know, we talk about history in terms of these kind of iconic moments. Like, we're taught that schools were almost desegregated in Little Rock, Arkansas, not appreciating that my father integrated my elementary school. Like, I didn't know that growing up, but my dad was the first integrated class at Travilah Elementary, which is where I went for, for kindergarten.

And then similarly, it was really important to talk about, [00:31:00] that along that same road, called Darnestown Road now, but where this one-room schoolhouse was erected in 1868 to educate colored Black children, that same road is the road that a lynch mob took to go to Rockville to, to hang a young man named John Diggs Dorsey, and then took that same route back up to Darnestown where they could, you know, kiss their, their loved ones and go to bed at night.

And so it's in that context and in that community that you are able to have these three churches come together and figure out, and still be in the process of figuring out, you know, how it's gonna work.

Bruce Anthony: I noticed while going to Quince Orchard, and it's the difference between Quince Orchard High School and Gaithersburg High School. That the majority of the population at Quince Orchard High School and [00:32:00] in Quince Orchard Is white. Did the merging of the churches contribute to Black history kind of being pushed aside and erased, and, and this is the reason why

Developers Tried Erasing Quince Orchard's History 💰🚧😬

Bruce Anthony: you growing up there, uh, all your life and me moving there in high school didn't know these things at

Jason Green: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's such a good question. I don't know if I can put that on the back of the merger, and this is, this is why. I mean, I think Quince Orchard as a place was going through significant transition, and there was definitely pressure, right? So frankly, it was Quince Orchard for my grandmother's generation, it was Quince Orchard for my father's generation, it was Gaithersburg for me, and now it's North Potomac,

Bruce Anthony: Yeah.

Jason Green: right?

Like, it, it has a whole new moniker for this new generation. And so there was a push to, to layer over [00:33:00] this, this language of Quince Orchard. When that high school was built, the desire was not for it to be called Quince Orchard High School, right? Even that was, uh, the desire was for it to be named some derivation of Potomac.

Potomac Valley, North Potomac High, something to sort of acknowledge that proximity to Potomac. So there were forces at play, wealthy forces, to try and, kind of rename that whole area, and in so doing, I think, you know, layer over some of that Black history for sure. Uh, I think they would have been happy to layer over the white history in that community too which, you know, those names also leave behind.

I think it was... this was a poor farming community. There were white folks, there were Black folks, and those progressive forces that wanted to name it something new were happy to forget about that, that, that poor past altogether. But one of the things I think that is telling about this merger is that [00:34:00] it's a conversation, I think, about power. I think your question is a great one because so often in these sorts of merging, it is the Black experience that gets subsumed, right? That, that is, that is glossed over and forgotten. One of the things I think is really powerful about the Fairhaven, Fairhaven is the name of the church that was born out of these three churches coming

Three Churches Shared Power So They Could Survive ⛪🤝✨

Jason Green: together They didn't exist in any of the old buildings, right?

They built a new building. They didn't take on the name of any of the old, churches. They built a new church and gave it a new name, and I think kind of brilliant in trying to breathe new life. And the, the church continues to be sort of evenly distributed from a demographic perspective, but also, I think importantly from a leadership perspective.

So they had those hard conversations about... And the women's commission is a good example. They decided early on that they were gonna have a Black, uh, president one year and a white president the next year. They decided that they were gonna do power sharing from the jump. [00:35:00] And l- to your point, I don't know that the population always, would've represented that, but they realized that that was necessary for the success.

And then the last thing I'll say on this is there were three original churches. Pleasant View was the historically Black congregation. Hunting Hill was the, was one of the white congregations. It had a northern affiliation. And then McDonald Chapel, one of the white churches, had a southern affiliation.

Of those three original churches, only one still remains, and it's that Black congregation. It's the Black church that's connected to that schoolhouse, that's connected to that social hall, that's connected to that cemetery plot. And I think it's really important because it's an example of that this merger took place, and to your question about the Black history component, the, the history components, the, the buildings, the, the, the memories that are connected to those buildings still stand.

And now it's our responsibility to [00:36:00] preserve them, to, to translate them, to make them relevant to a new generation. But the, the fact that those buildings

Why Black History Is Still Too Precious To Lose 🖤📚💯

Jason Green: are still there, I think is a testament to the, the mindset of those folks that were willing to engage in this merger to preserve a congregation, but to pres- to keep this homestead, to preserve a culture

Bruce Anthony: When did you come up with the title for your book? Because I think it's just absolutely per- perfect, and it explains how our history is too precious to lose. Because this is something that a lot of people don't know about, I've talked about it on this podcast before. The Pentagon, I live two, three miles away from the Pentagon, used to be thriving Black community

that they took from the Black people through eminent domain to build the Pentagon and then disperse that Black community.

It was a thriving [00:37:00] Black community here in Arlington, Virginia that's no longer there. So it is, our history is too precious to lose. So when you're hearing these stories and you're doing this research and you say, "I'm gonna write a book," how did you come to that title?

Jason Green: Easy answer. So Too Precious to Lose is the theme of that three-acre historic site. Pleasant View, I'm talking about the schoolhouse, the church, social hall, cemeterial plot. The, the Black community of Queen's Orchard has, since those churches merged, have had the responsibility to preserve that site.

And, and it's now in a private trust, you know. And historically, they've only been able to look internally, right? You preserve it by protecting it. You sort of turn insular. And this is a moment where we're trying to figure out how to preserve that site by promoting it, by sharing [00:38:00] it, as it's going to reopen on June 20th for the first time since the pandemic.

And, you know, that site has a history that's relevant to the community, and it's really important that we figure out how those community members be stewards of this concept of it being too precious to lose, right? If it's just the Black folk that have a generational connection to that site, at some point that dies off.

And so part of what this idea is, how do we preserve a history that's too precious to lose, ensure that our children understand it, but also create space for a community that's ever-changing to recognize the, the, the dynamism of this? I think that this is important about Black history generally. Oddly, I, I think it's really hard for white folk to look at Black history and, and see lessons, right?

I think they look at it and see often shame. And so that's hence comes some of the erasure, right? Like, "I don't wanna, I don't wanna feel bad about this [00:39:00] history." What we're trying to say is that there's a lesson to be learned from the way in which this site was founded with people who had far fewer resources than us, had no real reason to dream, but yet dreamed and built.

And at the same time, a people who figured out how to exist in a time where they also were about to, no longer be able to sustain the faith that, and the culture that they had had. Like, there's lessons to be drawn there regardless of one's racial or religious tradition. And so that's part of... I think it's really important.

That obviously is too precious to lose, but it's too precious to lose for, I think, more than who would historically think about this history being relevant for them.

​

Bruce Anthony: As you're researching this book and you're [00:40:00] learning new information, was there a point in time during your research and the writing that you said, "Okay, this is getting way more emotional. I need to take a little bit of a break. I need to step away and take a little bit of a break and then come back to it"?

Because I would imagine Me being a historian that I am, when I learn ab- when I learned about the Pentagon, and, and this wasn't something that I learned 20 years ago. This was something that I learned 10 years ago after living in this area for 10 years, right? That that's what happened. When you get this new information, when you research, it hits you on a personal level. How did that affect you while you were writing this book? And was there a, a point in time where you just said, "You know what? I need to take a break for a day, a week, maybe two weeks, maybe even a month, then come back to this"?

Researching Family History Became Deeply Emotional 😢📖🧠

Jason Green: Sure. It's interesting because I don't think I ever-- Until I had a book written, I don't think I knew I [00:41:00] was writing a book.

Um, in many respects, I just wanted to sit with my grandmother, but then she would shoo me out of her, her hospital room, right? So, so I would gravitate towards some story that I found interesting, the churches being a good example, but there were plenty of other things that I would perk up on, and she'd be like: "Oh, baby, if that interests you, you should go talk to Ms.

Howard, or you should go talk to Ms. Blair. You should go talk to Mr. Johnson." And so she would send me out, and so ultimately, I ended up talking to, like, eighty people who were of that age in this community and putting these stories down on paper. Kinda going back to a question you asked earlier, like, when did I think that there was a story here?

It was when I started hearing bits and pieces from Ms. Blair over here, who was a hundred-year-old white woman, and then hearing the same bits and pieces reflected over here from Cousin Melvin, who was a seventy-five-year-old Black man. Like, how are these the same pieces of story? And so that started to, That was the exercise. I think if I had [00:42:00] sat down day one and been like, "I wanna write a book," I don't think I would've ever gotten there. Uh, it would've been, it would've been too overwhelming. I mean, there's so-- The way that the book, the way that Too Precious to Lose kinda unfolds is really how it unfolded for me.

When I learn about the community, when I learn about the churches, when I

Sitting With Elders Changed His Entire Perspective 👵❤️✨

Jason Green: learn about my family, right, our connection to slavery, all of those pieces were reveals for us. And so I wanted to convey them in the same way for the reader. But man, I, I don't think that I would've put the auspicious task on myself to, to go out and write a book.

I mean, what I should say to folks, though, and this is for all your listeners and viewers you don't have to write a book, but you should sit with your loved ones. Right? Make the time. I was gracious. I was-- I'm grateful that I got a wake-up call to go and sit with my grandmother. Like, that time was not promised.

But everyone should do this exercise. You don't have to write a book. You don't have to make a movie. You don't have to do anything else. But I am [00:43:00] better because I got to sit with my grandmother. I'm better because I got to sit with a lot of other people whose stories align with mine. And I'm better 'cause I got to sit with a lot of people whose stories conflict with mine, and I got to...

You know, I have to wrestle with all of that and figure out how to carry it. And so I can't tell you, Bruce, how many people I run into who say: "I was supposed to do that? I was supposed to record my mom or my grandma or great uncle, whoever had the stories or the pictures?" And, uh, all I say is we, we can't wait.

Uh, and it doesn't have-- We talked about this earlier. You know, s- history's told in these iconic moments, and this gives us an opportunity to fill in the gaps and just tell a fuller and richer story.

Bruce Anthony: This book almost seems like it's a love letter to your grandmother. It's also a history, historical book, but also a love letter to your grandmother. And, and with that, and you [00:44:00] hearing so many people saying, "I should have," and, "I should have," how, how much emphasis and importance do you wanna impart on the younger generation, and, and maybe our generation as well, 'cause I might not be so good at that, to just

Young People Are Searching Hard For Real Community 📱😔🤝

Bruce Anthony: sit down with your elders and learn?

Because they have history, and through history, there's a cheat code to the future.

Jason Green: Yes

Bruce Anthony: So like, how, how, how can we implore the youth to just dive into this community that, that really gets looked past, that gets joked on for being old or you're a boomer, you don't understand what's going on. No, maybe you don't understand what's going on.

Jason Green: Right.

Right

Bruce Anthony: do we touch that, that younger generation?

Jason Green: is so critical, and I'm grateful in this journey, in the, in "Too Precious to Lose," I talk about it just a little bit. But part of what [00:45:00] spurred me on this journey was a couple of high school students that I ran into at Quince Orchard who said, "That's really cool." Like, "I wanna understand that history.

I wanna help unearth that history." And they said, "How can we help?" And I didn't wanna, you know, I didn't wanna mute or dim the lights of young people, and so I said, "Let's figure it out together." And I'm grateful that we did because that led to a documentary and ultimately led to a book. But again, I was busy.

I had other things I needed to do. I wanted to sit with my grandmother for a little while, get, get a couple stories, and it was that younger generation. What's really special, Bruce, is that this-- We're dealing with, I, I would say, a real pandemic of community and connection, right? Uh, the surgeon general said that we've got an epidemic of, of loneliness and isolation, and that's really affecting...

Historically, it's affected elderly people. Right now it's also affecting young people as they're turning to social media for the connection, and it's not satisfying. [00:46:00] What I found by doing this story, I brought those young people along with me to sit with elderly people. And so when I was interviewing Grandma or Doctor or Mrs.

Blair or Miss Johnson, whomever, they were there with me, and they were, you know, a pop- a, a community that was most comfortable sort of looking at their phone would put the phone down and listen a little bit more, and by the end they'd be asking follow-up questions to understand more. And so it was helping them build empathy for sure.

It's important to be able to walk in someone else's story. But it was also teaching them the skills to connect. Like, how do we actually connect socially? How do we understand someone else's story? How do we

Social Media Cannot Replace Genuine Human Connection 📵💔🧍

Jason Green: understand something that conflicts with our own? And I think that's the gift that my dad and my grandmother gave to me, right?

Growing up the son of a preacher and being a volunteer assistant to my grandmother, I got to sit with a lot of elderly people early in life. I got to sort of engage and understand that skill set. [00:47:00] Even if I didn't wanna deal with my grandparents on the way to school at Quince Orchard, I did it enough that I understood and had a perspective and a respect.

And so I think young people are hungry for it. People love to be connected and, and to be better rooted, as you just said, in your own community, right? The story of the Pentagon, the story of the rich Black community that exists and thrived there. I can tell you that there's a generation of people who know that story and happy to share it with you.

And so in the places where we live, there are people who have these stories that can make us feel more rooted, not just to each other, but into place. And I think people are hungry for it. Uh, Pew had some really interesting data where, uh, young people were claiming that they wanted community. Through the charts they knew the right answer.

If someone moves into the neighborhood, do you wanna meet them? Yes. Do you wanna know their name? Yes. Would you help them with a, a, a small task like carrying a grocery item? Yes. Do you know their names? No. [00:48:00] Do you say hello to people that move into the neighborhood? No. Uh, do you think that someone would help you with a small grocery item?

No. So there's this, like, idea and desire to build community. There's just a fear that community won't meet us back. And so I think this is a really easy, available on-ramp to, to, to build some of those skill sets and, and connect people more rootedly into place

Bruce Anthony: You know that was full cir- full circle, right? You know, what you did for those high school students is the exact same thing that your grandmother did when she took you into those rooms. That was a full circle. Wow. That's just amazing.

Jason Green: Wow. Yeah. Wow

Why So Much Black History Continues Getting Erased 😳📚🕳️

Bruce Anthony: you're, you're, you're done. The book is out. You're doing interviews, you're doing shows. The main theme is a growing sense of community, but also preserving history. I [00:49:00] wanna speak directly to, and this is a dumb question. I know this is a dumb question, but it's a question and I'm interested in hearing your perspective on.

Why do you think so many Black communities and the stories disappear from American history? Outside of the guilt, why do you think they disappear so much? Is it just because our communities and more specifically membership in the Black church is decreasing?

Jason Green: Mhm.

Bruce Anthony: Is it more than that? What's, what's the-- Is it-- What's the macro looking at it?

What's Why is it that so much of our history is not passed down to the next generation?

Jason Green: It's, it's a layered, complicated answer and not a dumb question at all. You know, in, in, in Two Persons to Lose, [00:50:00] I talk about my grandmother when I went to her, she's my oracle, right? She knew the answer to all my questions. And so I said, "Grandma, are we descendants from slaves?" And she said, "Baby, there was no slavery in this part of Maryland."

And so I sort of scratched my head and said, "Okay," you know, she-- That's Grandma, and so I assumed her to be right. And then I, of course, did my research, and I was like, "I don't think slavery quite worked that way," and, and, and I not only, you know, affirmed my, my understanding of slavery, but also found the slave records of our, our family in Montgomery County.

And she quickly said, "You know, that's just not something that was talked about." Right? Like, that history was not something that was talked about. It was too painful, it was too hard, and there was a desire to, you know, shield this next generation from that. I think that when you're talking specifically about the role of the Black community in preserving stories, some-- That has been a significant part of it, that there is a perspective that we [00:51:00] don't want to tell that part.

We don't wanna pass down that part. We don't wanna pass down the

Families Refused To Speak About Generational Trauma 🧠😔🖤

Jason Green: trauma. Well, the reality is the trauma gets passed down either way,

Bruce Anthony: Yeah.

Jason Green: right? Like that, that trauma we know now is generational. And you see it even, uh, in the Pleasant View story. You know, Pleasant View was in the situation that it was in in nineteen sixty-eight because a generation told the next generation that they didn't want them to live on the farm the same way that the last generation had.

They said, "No, no, no, don't-- We don't want you to have this life. We want you to move to Washington, DC. We want you to go get those good government jobs. Go to Baltimore," right? Go-- And so as people moved off of the farm, they were unable, they didn't have the population to sustain the church, but in so doing, they also didn't have the population to sustain the history.

So one of the things I think is so important and representative about this story, right, going back to this idea of merging, I, I did a show, I did, I did Morning Joe, and w-we're talking about this, and you could see, like, every white [00:52:00] host is so excited about this church merger, and Al Sharpton's like, "I don't know."

You know, he's just, like, looking at this thing sideways and, and he knows that historically, that means that history is gonna be erased and, and, and this idea is gonna be subsumed. And when I told him that this church, these three churches had merged, and yet this historic site still remained, that this, you know, that sustained the, the Black church, the schoolhouse, the, the social hall, he was like, "Oh, interesting."

And so what-- The argument I'm trying to make is that, you know, you can have this sort of pluralistic society and it's... If you're going to have it, it is best when you have truth, right? When you have history, when you have the culture, right? O-otherwise, it is just what Melvin said in the book, you know, you're putting cream into your coffee.

W- Part of what makes this interesting is to have those experiences, right? That's why democracy and pluralism is interesting, is to honor that culture and that history. So I think part of [00:53:00] it, a small part of it has been kind of the Black community's concern about passing down portions of the story and trying to, you

Reconciliation Means Nothing Without Complete Truth ⚖️🗣️💯

Jason Green: know you know, imbue a new generation with, with new opportunities.

Uh, someone asked me once "How do we build resilient children as we're trying to give our kids more and more and more?" And I said, "You gotta tell them the stories." Like, our history is a story of resilience, of the places that we've been. But I think it, it is also is really important to put onus on the those that tell history stories, right?

Like, we are still writing this history. We're telling the story of the Pentagon. You are, you know... The commission I led in Montgomery County, the Remembrance and Reconciliation Commission, there was very little, if any, record of three men that had been lynched in Montgomery County. Certainly didn't exist in your curriculum, right, my curriculum when we were going, going to school.

And so there's still a responsibility to just [00:54:00] tell a fuller story, to get these stories into curriculum, and part of that is, like, going to those that write curriculum, that, that write the textbooks, that write curriculum, who are so happy to, to leave these sorts of stories out, uh, because of the guilt, because of the shame, 'cause it paints a, a, a, a history of America that isn't entirely consistent with the story that we wanna tell about America.

I think it tells a fuller story, right? Part of what I have to, wrestle with chairing that commission is this idea of reconciliation, right? I was kind of a reconciliation first kinda guy. I was like a get everybody hands together kumbaya moment, and had... took me a while through this work to realize that none of that is meaningful unless you have the truth component, right?

Unless we have truth, you can't get to the reconciliation. Unless we have a fuller history, you can't... Like, show me the relationship that's gotten better just with time. Like, you have to [00:55:00] actually address the harm. And so I think that's the piece that i- is, is often

Preserving History Is Everyone's Shared Responsibility 📖🌍✨

Jason Green: left out, right, through erasure, but is absolutely necessary if we ever wanna sort of make our way on the winding path towards reconciliation.

Bruce Anthony: Wow, Jason, that's just a powerful way to end this interview, to end this episode. I wanna personally, for somebody that I've known for 20-plus years, to say thank you, uh, for coming on the show, for giving me new information about an area that I'm from. Teaching the audience not just about the history of this area, but to also take this lesson of talk to your elders, get into your community, learn about your community, learn about where you from.

Just thank you so much for coming on the show. I'm so proud of you for the person that you are, for the accomplishments that you have made and are going to continue to make, and [00:56:00] I can't thank you enough for, for coming on the show. So thank you.

Jason Green: Brother, so good to see you. Appreciate you, proud of you. Thank you for the, using the platform the way that you are. I appreciate you having me on, and just the way in which you lift up stories and, and sort of make us all proud of the culture. Just so appreciative, brother. Thank you

Bruce Anthony: Thank you.

Talk To Your Elders Before Their Stories Disappear ⏳👵❤️

Bruce Anthony: One of the things that really stood out to me during this conversation with Jason is that history is not just about dates, documents, and old buildings. History is about people. It's about memory, it's about community, and it's about responsibility. Because if we don't preserve our stories, somebody else will either rewrite them or erase them completely.

And listening to Jason talk about sitting beside his grandmother, hearing stories that had been sitting in plain sight his entire life, it really hit me. Because how many of us have elders in our family carrying an entire world inside of them, [00:57:00] and we never slow down long enough to ask questions? That's really what this conversation became about.

Not just Black history, but the preservation of human connection. Jason talked about how he almost missed it all, how he was so focused on success, on the White House, on public service, on achievement, that he hadn't fully sat with the people who built the foundation beneath him. And honestly, I think a lot of us are guilty of that.

We're chasing the next thing so hard that we forget the people who made it possible for us to chase anything at all. And what makes this story even more important is that it exposes something America has always struggled with: telling the full truth. Because these Black communities didn't just disappear naturally.

These stories weren't just lost over time. A lot of this history was neglected, ignored, paved over, underfunded, or intentionally left out of the larger [00:58:00] American narrative. Jason talked about thriving Black communities in Montgomery County, Maryland. I've talked before on this show about the thriving Black community that existed where the Paragon- the Pentagon stands today.

These stories are everywhere once you start looking for them. But here's the uncomfortable part people don't want to talk about. You can't have reconciliation without truth. That was probably one of the most powerful things Jason said in this interview.

Everybody loves the idea of unity. Everybody loves the idea of coming together. But you can't heal what you refuse to acknowledge, and you can't preserve a culture if you keep erasing the evidence that it ever existed in the first place. That's why Too Precious to Lose matters. Not just because it tells a story of Quince Orchard, not just because it tells a story of his family, but because it reminds us that history is alive.

It's sitting in our grandparents' living room. It's in the pho- family photo albums. It's in the church basements. It's in the communities [00:59:00] people drive past every day without realizing the significance of the ground beneath them. And I think the biggest lesson from this entire conversation is simple: Go talk to your elders Ask the questions now.

Record the stories now. Learn your community now. Because once those voices are gone, you can't get them back. And maybe that's the real responsibility we all carry, to remember, to tell the truth about where we come from, to leave behind something more honest for people coming after us than what was left for us.

Because history does not survive on its own. People have to choose to preserve it. Ladies and gentlemen, I want to thank you for listening. I want to thank you for watching, and until next time, as always, I'll holla

Woo. That was a hell of a show. Thank you for rocking with us [01:00:00] here on Unsolicited Perspectives with Bruce Anthony. Now, before you go, don't forget to follow, subscribe, like, comment, and share our podcast. Wherever you're listening or watching it to it, pass it along to your friends. If you enjoy it, that means the people that you rock, we'll enjoy it also.

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